Discussion:
New update for WeatherSix
BJ Johns
2004-08-02 01:29:00 UTC
Permalink
v1.0.3 - 08/01/04

-Simulated zooming of the radar image can now be performed by pressing the
'ZOOM IN' and 'ZOOM OUT' buttons when viewing the radar screen.
-If you have multiple locations defined, you can now jump to a specific
location by pressing the 'FAST FORWARD' button and then choose a location
from the list.
-Added ability to run in screen saver mode (command line parameter '-saver')
-The current conditions and forecasted weather data for each location is now
cached for 5 minutes to reduce network traffic.
-Added the sunrise and sunset times to the current conditions section.

See more details on the Setup page on the updated web site at
http://home.earthlink.net/~weathersix/
Joe Saul
2004-08-02 13:32:04 UTC
Permalink
Hi -- new HD1000 owner here; I've had it since last Wednesday. My
questions are likely to be less sophisticated than some, so I apologize in
advance.

I installed the new version of WeatherSixlast night, and it isn't running
for me. I suspect I've made a mistake, so here's what I did and maybe
you can help...

I have all of the working files for all of the applications I've installed
in the root directory of a 256MB CF card. (The other apps work fine, and
WeatherSix did work fine until the new version.)

I renamed WeatherSix.roku to WeatherSix.rxxe and downloaded the script
that starts the swapfile first. I also put one of the other backgrounds
into the Images directory.

When I start WeatherSix, I get the background and layout, but with no
data. My list of locations doesn't give the city name for the first city,
though the zip is still there. When I page through locations, I get more
blank background and layout screens.

I deleted all the locations, but that didn't help. I also deleted all the
tmp files on the card (there were a lot of them -- shouldn't it be
cleaning this up?). That didn't help either.

Should I have each of the apps in a separate directory? I didn't want to
have to go down a level to run them.

Thanks for any help you can provide!

-- Joe
Post by BJ Johns
v1.0.3 - 08/01/04
-Simulated zooming of the radar image can now be performed by pressing the
'ZOOM IN' and 'ZOOM OUT' buttons when viewing the radar screen.
-If you have multiple locations defined, you can now jump to a specific
location by pressing the 'FAST FORWARD' button and then choose a location
from the list.
-Added ability to run in screen saver mode (command line parameter '-saver')
-The current conditions and forecasted weather data for each location is now
cached for 5 minutes to reduce network traffic.
-Added the sunrise and sunset times to the current conditions section.
See more details on the Setup page on the updated web site at
http://home.earthlink.net/~weathersix/
_______________________________________________
Roku-tech mailing list
http://lists.rokulabs.com/mailman/listinfo/roku-tech
BJ Johns
2004-08-02 13:54:08 UTC
Permalink
The first thing that I could suggest is to reboot your HD1000 to see if that
corrects the problem. I'm not sure what you mean by "My list of locations
doesn't give the city name for the first city, though the zip is still
there."

When you mentioned that there were a lot of tmp files, what were their
names? The WeatherSix application will create a temporary file, beginning
with the name 'WeatherSixRadar', in the /tmp directory when you view radar
images but will/should delete this single file when the application is
shutdown.

-BJ
Post by Joe Saul
Hi -- new HD1000 owner here; I've had it since last Wednesday. My
questions are likely to be less sophisticated than some, so I apologize in
advance.
I installed the new version of WeatherSixlast night, and it isn't running
for me. I suspect I've made a mistake, so here's what I did and maybe
you can help...
I have all of the working files for all of the applications I've installed
in the root directory of a 256MB CF card. (The other apps work fine, and
WeatherSix did work fine until the new version.)
I renamed WeatherSix.roku to WeatherSix.rxxe and downloaded the script
that starts the swapfile first. I also put one of the other backgrounds
into the Images directory.
When I start WeatherSix, I get the background and layout, but with no
data. My list of locations doesn't give the city name for the first city,
though the zip is still there. When I page through locations, I get more
blank background and layout screens.
I deleted all the locations, but that didn't help. I also deleted all the
tmp files on the card (there were a lot of them -- shouldn't it be
cleaning this up?). That didn't help either.
Should I have each of the apps in a separate directory? I didn't want to
have to go down a level to run them.
Thanks for any help you can provide!
-- Joe
Post by BJ Johns
v1.0.3 - 08/01/04
-Simulated zooming of the radar image can now be performed by pressing the
'ZOOM IN' and 'ZOOM OUT' buttons when viewing the radar screen.
-If you have multiple locations defined, you can now jump to a specific
location by pressing the 'FAST FORWARD' button and then choose a location
from the list.
-Added ability to run in screen saver mode (command line parameter '-saver')
-The current conditions and forecasted weather data for each location is now
cached for 5 minutes to reduce network traffic.
-Added the sunrise and sunset times to the current conditions section.
See more details on the Setup page on the updated web site at
http://home.earthlink.net/~weathersix/
_______________________________________________
Roku-tech mailing list
http://lists.rokulabs.com/mailman/listinfo/roku-tech
Joe Saul
2004-08-02 14:01:48 UTC
Permalink
Post by BJ Johns
The first thing that I could suggest is to reboot your HD1000 to see if that
corrects the problem. I'm not sure what you mean by "My list of locations
doesn't give the city name for the first city, though the zip is still
there."
I've rebooted (unplugged the power cord) and it had no effect.

List of locations: on the list you get when you hit the Menu key, the
first entry was "48103" without the city name "Ann Arbor".
Post by BJ Johns
When you mentioned that there were a lot of tmp files, what were their
names? The WeatherSix application will create a temporary file, beginning
with the name 'WeatherSixRadar', in the /tmp directory when you view radar
images but will/should delete this single file when the application is
shutdown.
The names of the files were pretty generic, and WeatherSixRadar wasn't one
of them. (I'm at the office, so I can't check what the names actually
were, but they were all in a form like temp01.tmp with different numbers.)

-- Joe
Joe Saul
2004-08-03 00:28:55 UTC
Permalink
Well, it turns out that the problem wasn't with WeatherSix at all -- it
was something much simpler. The hub that the HD1000 is plugged into was
powered off, so no internet access. User error, and I apologize for not
catching it until now.

I guess the only suggestion I'd have related to this is that it would be
neat if WeatherSix would kick up a "You need to be connected to the
Internet" error message and exit gracefully instead of just acting
strange. It did better than LiveSpy, though, which crashed the HD1000.
;-)

Live and learn...

-- Joe
Joe Saul
2004-08-03 00:34:57 UTC
Permalink
Is there any way to set things up so the HD1000 will wake up a sleeping
MacOSX box to access the network share on it, instead of being unable to
access it?

-- Joe
David Wuertele
2004-08-03 00:41:17 UTC
Permalink
Joe> Is there any way to set things up so the HD1000 will wake up a
Joe> sleeping MacOSX box to access the network share on it, instead of
Joe> being unable to access it?

Is there any way to wake up a sleeping MacOSX box over the network?
Joe Saul
2004-08-03 01:11:46 UTC
Permalink
Post by David Wuertele
Joe> Is there any way to set things up so the HD1000 will wake up a
Joe> sleeping MacOSX box to access the network share on it, instead of
Joe> being unable to access it?
Is there any way to wake up a sleeping MacOSX box over the network?
Supposedly there is, but I haven't tried it. Here's some discussion of
how to do it: http://forums.macosxhints.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=9505

-- Joe
Jay A. Kreibich
2004-08-03 01:23:41 UTC
Permalink
Post by David Wuertele
Joe> Is there any way to set things up so the HD1000 will wake up a
Joe> sleeping MacOSX box to access the network share on it, instead of
Joe> being unable to access it?
Is there any way to wake up a sleeping MacOSX box over the network?
Yes. If enabled, a Mac will respond to the standard Wake-on-LAN
"magic packet".

-j
--
Jay A. Kreibich | Integration & Software Eng.
***@uiuc.edu | Campus IT & Edu. Svcs.
<http://www.uiuc.edu/~jak> | University of Illinois at U/C
Joe Saul
2004-08-03 01:36:02 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jay A. Kreibich
Yes. If enabled, a Mac will respond to the standard Wake-on-LAN
"magic packet".
I assume to enable that, you go into the Energy Saver control panel and
check "Wake for Ethernet network administrator access"? I've had that
checked, so the HD1000 doesn't seem to be sending a Wake-on-LAN packet
now.

-- Joe
Peter Gutbrod
2004-08-04 12:22:21 UTC
Permalink
Wake on LAN (with the OS X apps Wake550 or WakeUp) works on my LAN with Macs
and PCs (Windows, Linux). I didn't try it over the internet so far.

What I miss is a "wake on network access" mode. Why? I'd like the idea of
having a central storage for music, pictures and some other kind of files
accessible from several Macs and other clients (e.g. Soundbridge). Prices of
consumer NAS devices are dropping constantly, so they are now quite an
interesting solution for this request. They are easy to install, low power
consuming (some even without a fan and automatic power down/up of the
harddrive on access), but at least the cheaper ones have low transfer rates
(2 MB/s on a 100MBit Network) and no AFP support (SMP/NFS on OS X works but
is a little bit ugly; no file creation dates preserved f.e.). And with the
strong binding of Soundbridge to iTunes, they are no option at all to serve
your music library to the Soundbridge. Probably a lot of us have an old G3
or G4 Powermac, which would happily do a good job as a file server and music
server (by running iTunes in shared mode). Its free (if you own it already
but don't use it any more), has latest AFP, can run iTunes - perfect, but
you must have it running 24h/day or every Mac/client, that wants to access
it, has to cast his WOL magic packet spell first. That is at least tedious
and can be tricky/impossible on clients you cannot control via scripts, like
the Soundbridge.

In good old OS 9 there were two wake up checkboxes in the energy control
panel, "wake on administrative network access" and "wake on network access".
The second one has vanished with OS X. Don't know what "wake on network
access" really did. I never tried it and I can't find any information on
Apple support about that option. Probably it was added for future Macs, that
never made it to release state.

Well, a more academic discussion, as I don't want to deal with OS 9 any
more, especially not for any kind of file sharing, which is really slow on
OS 9 in compare to OS X. But if the hardware of late OS 9 Macs would be able
to wake on simple network access (without sending the magic string for WOL),
it should be possible to add such an option with some kind of 3rd party app
to OS X as well. Didn't find such an app so far, but if someone steps over
one, it would be nice to share that information with us.

Another idea would be using an ethernet/USB device (kind of switch), that
listens for network access requests to the sleeping Mac and, in case there
are any, wakes the Mac via the USB port (or via WOL). That device probably
could send some initial information back to the requesting machine to
prevent a timeout. Someone should invent this device in case it doesn't
exist yet ;-)

--Peter
Jay A. Kreibich
2004-08-04 15:55:07 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter Gutbrod
Wake on LAN (with the OS X apps Wake550 or WakeUp) works on my LAN with Macs
and PCs (Windows, Linux). I didn't try it over the internet so far.
Wake-on-LAN depends on knowing the system's Ethernet MAC address.
It is pretty trivial for systems that are on the same subnet to
discover this, but this information is not easily available to
systems on a different network. You can still generate a
Wake-on-LAN packet from an off-network system, it just has to
discover the MAC address somehow (e.g. have someone type it in).
The question is if that packet will be delivered. Some routers won't
pass a packet on to a sleeping host, since it can't properly ARP for
the MAC address. It depends on how stale the ARP cache entry is
(e.g. how long the machine has been asleep), and what the router's
cache-flush policy is.

This makes it (sometimes) possible to use Wake-on-LAN from a different
network (e.g. across the Internet), it just isn't easy to do-- you cannot
use Wake-on-LAN to DoS a remote network, for example, unless you have
prior knowledge-- and even then, there is some question on if you can
do it or not.
Post by Peter Gutbrod
In good old OS 9 there were two wake up checkboxes in the energy control
panel, "wake on administrative network access" and "wake on network access".
Another idea would be using an ethernet/USB device (kind of switch), that
listens for network access requests to the sleeping Mac and, in case there
are any, wakes the Mac via the USB port (or via WOL). That device probably
could send some initial information back to the requesting machine to
prevent a timeout. Someone should invent this device in case it doesn't
exist yet ;-)
The basic problem with all of these schemes is that there is a lot of
network access you don't care about. Most networks send a sizable*
number of broadcasts-- it is a normal part of network operation. I
suppose you could choose to ignore broadcasts, but many unicast
transactions start with a broadcast transaction (ARPing for the MAC
address-- remember, we are talking about a machine that can be
assumed to be asleep for some time). There's also the problem of
scans (both virus and such, but also stuff like AppleTalk and service
discovery protocols).

* sizable in the sense of "packets per hour", not in
terms of total bandwidth

I suppose such a system could be built, but the rules for what you
consider "wakeable" and what aren't would be pretty complex. You'd
also need a semi-operational network stack, so you couldn't really
truly put the machine to sleep. Using an external device, like a
USB dongle of some kind, introduces a lot of other problems, like
switch port isolation and MAC address cloning and stuff. Its a lot
harder than it sounds.

I think the real solution is better power management on the host
machine. If you want the machine really truly asleep, it should be
asleep and it should be fairly hard to wake. If all you want it
something that will go into a low-power mode, you really just want a
highly efficient machine that is capable of shutting disks down and
idling the processor back-- features found in most modern laptops.

-j
--
Jay A. Kreibich | Integration & Software Eng.
***@uiuc.edu | Campus IT & Edu. Svcs.
<http://www.uiuc.edu/~jak> | University of Illinois at U/C
Peter Gutbrod
2004-08-05 14:32:01 UTC
Permalink
Thanks, Jay, for that detailed statement.
Post by Jay A. Kreibich
I think the real solution is better power management on the host
machine. If you want the machine really truly asleep, it should be
asleep and it should be fairly hard to wake. If all you want it
something that will go into a low-power mode, you really just want a
highly efficient machine that is capable of shutting disks down and
idling the processor back-- features found in most modern laptops.
Yes, you are right, better power management is the real solution.
Unfortunately we do not have any Macs, including the PowerBooks, which have
this efficient power management, and it doesn't look like Apple is doing
development in the area of low power servers.
As I do not have a spare PowerBook, I don't plan to purchase one just to use
it as a fileserver. Even a secondhand PowerBook is much to expensive for
that job. I'm investigating in an ITX system with a VIA C3 processor. Well
it is not a Mac but for a low power, silent, headless server, that looks
like the better alternative.

Peter
Joe Saul
2004-08-07 15:02:31 UTC
Permalink
This may be a naive question, but would it be possible to run a WAP
browser (or some other small web client) on the HD1000?

-- Joe

BJ Johns
2004-08-03 00:36:16 UTC
Permalink
That's good to hear! I was just looking into what might be the cause of
your problems.

I do have plans to improve on the error handling for situations such as this
and you have highlighted why I should put this enhancement at the top of my
list. I do hope to have another version out around mid month with this
feature....That is if I can find the spare time to work on it.

Thanks,
-BJ Johns
Post by Joe Saul
Well, it turns out that the problem wasn't with WeatherSix at all -- it
was something much simpler. The hub that the HD1000 is plugged into was
powered off, so no internet access. User error, and I apologize for not
catching it until now.
I guess the only suggestion I'd have related to this is that it would be
neat if WeatherSix would kick up a "You need to be connected to the
Internet" error message and exit gracefully instead of just acting
strange. It did better than LiveSpy, though, which crashed the HD1000.
;-)
Live and learn...
-- Joe
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